Tax Reform?


#183

I would say they are more the exception then the norm :wink: It takes really egregious wrongdoing for something more then a slap on the wrist for a fair bit of white collar fraud


#184

My point is corporations are above the law. They can spend as much as they want to pervert our elections. Can break laws and pay a fine that is really paid by stock holders.
They obviously have Congress in their pockets, ready to give them the biggest tax break in history…
Corporate officers should go to jail for corporate crimes.
Corporations should not be allowed to donate money to politics. And they should not be allowed to hide profits tax free overseas… Then can have their tax break… 25 %
Not 20%

BTW. Not one corporate officer was made to pay for the financial crisis… There are several of these bastards that I think should be executed… Especially all the subprime CEOs


#185

A poor guy, trying to feed his newborn can go for many years to jail, while the scumbag defrauding thousands of people will lawyer up and go free.

Watch one the videos above, they talk about Goldman Sachs and how they got away with murder. They were the creators of the security packages that created the housing mess.

Oh, anybody good at this? Carried interests are gone, well, somebody lied if that is not true.


#186

Marcus answered already Sarbanes-Oxley legislation. CEOs and CFOs must own when they sign, no escape. Any financial issues, esp public companies, can be traceable with Audit (in USA). If caught, they are put into jail by IRS, esp Tax fraud, either state or federal.

If you see internally Apple or Google or Facebook, there may be 100s of audits in a year and every week you will see one audit from some state/county or country.

This is the main reason that Trump with 5B+ worth business, his company or his wealth is audited every now and then.

Subprime loans were legally allowed in practice, no federal or state controlled at that time.

All downturns are creating financial crisis, that does not mean fraud !


#187

Oh boy, oh boy!

The supreme leader of investors has spoken!

Jim Cramer say this tax reform is no good for investors in the stock market, it will hit their pockets.

Individual investors are angry that the Senate Finance Committee has exempted large mutual funds from a provision in the tax bill aimed at preventing shareholders from minimizing taxes on stock sales.

The exemption was reported by The Wall Street Journal. But the provision will still hit individuals with full force, mandating that stock sellers unload their oldest shares first rather than picking the ones that are most tax-advantageous to sell.


#188

Did you ever buy stocks based on Jim Cramer? I can confidently say now “NO” when you call him as “supreme leader of investors”

Here is the best editorial provided by Wall Street Journal Today. They are telling everything what happened, read word by word and sentence by sentence, this is the truth.

By The Editorial Board
Nov. 19, 2017 4:59 p.m. ET

Liberals are denouncing Republican tax reform as a giveaway to big corporations, as they always do. But the irony is that the Senate and House bills would do far more to stop corporate tax gaming than anything the Obama Administration did in eight years. This includes preventing tax avoidance, levelling the tax field for U.S. multinationals, and stopping corporate inversions.

Start with cutting the corporate rate to 20% from 35%, which in a stroke offers less incentive for companies to move capital, income and intellectual property out of the U.S. to lower tax climes. During the Obama Administration, many U.S. companies “inverted” by merging with smaller foreign competitors to take advantage of lower tax rates abroad. The U.S. has the highest corporate rate in the developed world, whose average is 25%.

Inversions seek to make American companies more globally competitive and let them reinvest in the U.S. tax free. Under the current U.S. worldwide tax system, companies can defer taxes on their overseas profits until they bring them home—and then get smacked with the full 35% rate. Hence, corporations have parked $2.5 trillion or more abroad.

Both Senate and House bills move to a territorial system that exempts most foreign income from taxation. Most advanced economies have territorial systems, but they also have safeguards—i.e., base-erosion rules—to prevent abuse. Without these rules, companies could shift domestic income through foreign affiliates to lower tax jurisdictions and then bring the profits home without paying taxes.

The best tool to prevent base erosion is a low rate. Ireland has less cause to worry about tax avoidance with its 12.5% (6.25% for intellectual property) corporate rate than France whose government takes a third of corporate income but is now proposing to take 25%. But there are still zero-tax jurisdictions like Bermuda and the isle of Jersey where Apple recently located subsidiaries. Tax havens are especially attractive for locating IP since assets such as patents are intangible and mobile.

The House and Senate bills would impose an effective 10% rate on intangible property of U.S. multinationals that is held overseas. In return, U.S. companies like Apple and Google would be able to repatriate their income tax free. The Senate bill also creates a virtual patent box to entice foreign companies to move their patents to the U.S. by taxing their subsidiaries’ royalties at 12.5%.

While Ireland’s tax is lower, the European Union has sought to impose restrictions on patent boxes to prevent the flight of IP and profits. The Senate’s lower rate for IP could make the U.S. attractive to foreign innovators who want to take advantage of our strong legal patent protections.

Both bills would also prevent foreign multinationals from abusing “transfer pricing”—that is, inflating the price that their U.S. affiliates pay to license IP in order to shift profits overseas. U.S. companies can deduct these payments, and their foreign affiliates then pay taxes at lower rates. The potential for tax arbitrage is greater for IP since it’s hard for government authorities to value. What is a reasonable royalty for a patent? Apple will surely differ from the IRS.

To deter tax avoidance, the House bill threatens a 20% excise tax on all payments from U.S. affiliates to related foreign companies. However, American companies can avoid the excise tax by declaring the payments “effectively controlled income,” which would then be subject to the U.S. 20% corporate rate minus expenses and foreign tax credits. The bill would be minimal for most companies that aren’t exploiting tax havens, but would nonetheless prevent tax arbitrage.

House Republicans modified the provision after foreign multinationals that sell goods into the U.S. howled, though the rewrite is messy and the excise tax is a vestigial appendage that ought to be dropped. The Senate legislation includes a cleaner mechanism to deter base erosion that would effectively equalize the tax treatment of U.S. and foreign multinationals.

Both bills also include measures to prevent companies from loading up on debt in the U.S. (where interest is deductible) to capitalize foreign companies. The Senate establishes a slightly stricter limit on interest deductibility on debt that is issued to foreign affiliates, but both bills would curb the practice of earnings stripping that the Obama Administration sought late last year to stop with regulations.


We report all this because you’d think from the press coverage that corporate tax reform is all about enriching a few CEOs. The truth is that it’s a serious attempt to fix a broken U.S. code that has festered for years and made America increasingly uncompetitive as a destination for mobile global capital. The GOP reforms would help the economy and make it harder for corporations to avoid paying taxes


#189

Fannie and Freddie created mortgage backed securities. I should probably give up writing things out and just make memes.

If corporate taxes drop to 20%, that’s the same tax rate as carried interest. So it’d effectively be eliminated.


#190

Corporate welfare is all well and good…But the reality is everyone on this forum will be paying for it.
We are highly paid in a high tax state.We have no representation being in a Democratic state…So we can throw ourselves to the wolves and hope the corporations do the right thing or we can strangle this monster in its crib and leave the tax system as is…There are 5 Republican senators on our side…Hopefully they stop this corporate juggernaut. …

BTW this a real estate forum…It is ironic that a real estate guy is President and yet he is pushing a bill that could kill real estate values in his own state…let alone the rest of the country. .I personally think he is pushing this thing to keep the corporate wing of the GOP on board…I really don’t think he gives a crap either way…He definitely hasn’t read the bill and after all he pays no taxes…He just wants the elimination of the inheritance tax…

And lets be real the 20% rate was just spit balling…The Trumpstr loves to throw out outrageous offers,
Like throwing in getting rid of the Obamacare mandate. .He will settle for 25%…maybe that will allow for some more deductions. .


#191

WW average corporate tax rate is 23% and EU average is 19%. Yeah, the EU which is the land of social equality has a lower corporate tax rate than the US.


#192

Yeah and the EU ia a mess where nobody ever rises in social class.The world of no opportunity for all…The corporate world is slavery…Why should corporations be rewarded…I realize that most on this forum work for corporations and support them through stock ownership but true freedom is working for yourself and entrepreneurship. The government shouldn’t be helping corporations at the expense of small businesses and real estate entrepreneurs like myself…We employ more than 50% of Americans and we don’t export jobs overseas.

Sorry that is why I am a conservative. .Not because I want to support corporations or evangical wackjobs…Which between them now own the party.


#193

That says “opinion”. And somebody here likes “data”. He says emotional opinions are worthless. :rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:


#194

This a classic battle between main street and Wall Street…We will see…But the tax cut for the red state rednecks making under $50k is pure window dressing. …they are being led by the the nose…These rubes are continuously being used by Trump…When he finally takes away their healthcare, SS and savings to pay for this tax cut it will be too late…


#195

When I read from some dumb editorial articule the famous “liberal” word, you are talking about somebody being biased.

Shall I believe this piece of crap or the tax foundation?

The United States has the fourth highest statutory corporate income tax rate among the 202 jurisdictions surveyed. The U.S. rate of 38.91 percent (comprised of the federal statutory rate of 35 percent plus an average of the corporate income taxes levied by individual states) ranks only behind the United Arab Emirates (55 percent),[2] Comoros (50 percent), and Puerto Rico (39 percent). Comparatively, the average tax rate of the 202 jurisdictions surveyed is 22.96 percent,[3] or 29.41 percent weighted by GDP.[4]

Then, spare me the opinion. To understand anything, you need to understand the meaning of “one of the highest”.

Conclusion

The last time the United States reduced its federal corporate income tax rate was in 1986. Since then, countries throughout the world have significantly reduced their statutory tax rates. Today, the United States statutory corporate tax rate is one of the highest in the world and stands well above the worldwide average. Reducing the statutory corporate tax rate to around the worldwide average as part of tax reform could discourage profit shifting and encourage companies to locate investment in the United States.


#196

Yes, there’s going to be a revolution in this country. Which is good, that’s what Steve Bannon and Putin have wanted to do for a long time. Put everything on fire, start from the beginning again.

Tired of winning comrade?


#197

Great seeing all the opinions. .But how about compromising on 25%…America is the most attractive place to do business in the world. .We don’t have be whores like Ireland or Jersey to attract capital. .In fact we get all we want at 35%…So why give away the 5% by removing all deductions that help the middle class?


#198

Wow, what you posted supports the post of @Jil


#199

Being the idiot you are, you didn’t watch the video I suggested to watch. Did you?


#200

The United States has the fourth highest statutory corporate income tax rate among the 202 jurisdictions surveyed. The U.S. rate of 38.91 percent (comprised of the federal statutory rate of 35 percent plus an average of the corporate income taxes levied by individual states) ranks only behind the United Arab Emirates (55 percent),[2] Comoros (50 percent), and Puerto Rico (39 percent). Comparatively, the average tax rate of the 202 jurisdictions surveyed is 22.96 percent,[3] or 29.41 percent weighted by GDP.[4]

Then, spare me the opinion. To understand anything, you need to understand the meaning of “one of the highest”. <------here dummy, here! :rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:

Conclusion

The last time the United States reduced its federal corporate income tax rate was in 1986. Since then, countries throughout the world have significantly reduced their statutory tax rates. Today, the United States statutory corporate tax rate is one of the highest in the world and stands well above the worldwide average. Reducing the statutory corporate tax rate to around the worldwide average as part of tax reform could discourage profit shifting and encourage companies to locate investment in the United States.


#201

There was plenty if fraud…Mainly of investors were fraudently sold worthless bonds. …It was the wild west…I lost about $3m to people that in the old days I could have rightfully shot down on the street…So these banks and promoters played like wild west gunslingers and yet were shielded by bankrupctcy laws…not fair


#202
  1. Corporate taxes are less than 10% of taxes collected. They’ve never been the main source of revenue.
  2. Why would we want to make our companies selling products and services on other countries less competitive? We are the only developed country in the world that makes them pay taxes on foeroen earnings if they bring it back. The rest of the world doesn’t tax it again.
  3. We probably have grossly different definitions of middle class. The increase of standard deduction makes it so only 10% of tax returns would itemize. In other words, the new standard deduction is better for the middle class than the current itemization they currently get. So eliminating the deductions will only impact the top 10% who clearly aren’t middle class.
  4. Most of the top 10% had limited deductions anyway due to AMT. Now the deductions are just eliminated and there’s no more complexity of AMT.